Monomi
Headmaster
Posts: 1,192
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Post by Monomi on Oct 10, 2018 2:07:51 GMT
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Hiyoko Saionji
Blackened
The color of the Communist Manifesto
Posts: 627
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Post by Hiyoko Saionji on Oct 10, 2018 6:40:37 GMT
if anyone's interested akane is the numbskull that saved me. i think i'll ask you one individual question each and then go from there (we get three questions for each of you by the way). Oh and I predicted that one of you three would win. You all played both sides very very well, and it's really hard for me and others to part you, strategically and socially.
Shuichi: When I left the game, I was saying there were two people I'd never vote for. One was Akane, and you were the other. You treated me wrong on the Big Brother vote. You promised you'd vote with me, or as good as it, and when the vote came around, you said that you just didn't understand how BB works and you'd vote me anyway, which was either a stupid lie or really incompetent. And on the next vote you made no attempt to jury manage me at all, despite the fact that we had a fine relationship. Why should I forgive you?
Nagito: According to Mikan, you went around telling people that Shuichi was just your lackey, that you were controlling his every move etc. Given that literally nobody on the jury thinks that way, that either isn't true or you did a terrible job showing it. What separates you in a positive way from Shuichi?
Gundham: To be frank I think your opening speech is terrible. You've arbitrarily come up with seven random words and said like "oh yeah I was nice so I'm RESPECTABLE (tm)". Although you're right in your speech that you were closer with Celestia than Kyoko was, I think you were the socially weakest of that three. You hitched your vote to the wrong wagons early in the merge (voting with me twice) and got associated with that trio. You correctly flipped from that trio, but you did it in a way that pissed both of them off, and you flipped to another pair who, from my perspective, played both sides stronger than you did. In one sentence, without any word-salad, explain why I'm wrong.
also people didn't get along with me BECAUSE THEY SUCK that's the reason goddamnit. i'm really likeable i promise.
uh also the three question rule is pretty lame i think, i know the type of jurors that's going after but really, what's so wrong about you each get your own thread, everyone can post how they want? i think that's what the jurors and finalists want and it annoys me.
finally i think all three of you are pretty uninspiring winners. i correctly picked at f10 that one of you was winning, and it's a failure on everyone else's part that they let you guys get to the end. but i really would have preferred a celestia victory at the end of the day, given that she clearly played an aspect of the game incredibly right. i guess shuichi did that with challenges but still...
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Nagito Komaeda
Ultimate Lucky Student
Let's commit the perfect crime together so despair can become the foundation of hope!
Posts: 667
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Post by Nagito Komaeda on Oct 10, 2018 8:46:09 GMT
Mikan also told me I'm a cocky fuck who doesn't deserve to win and she's looking forward to rubbing salt in my face.  As painful as it was to have that conversation I think it did me good to hear some humbling backtalk. This isn't really your question but. The only person I discussed my relationship with Shuichi with was Mikan. Calling him my lackey is her words. I said she saw him as the one controlling my every move when from my perspective he'd done everything I'd told him to, including lying on my behalf multiple times. I noticed he left any evidence we'd ever plotted together before an F3 pact out of his opening speech which should be evidence enough he doesn't want to talk about it. What separates us positively? He was never my entire plan and I didn't rely on him to get anywhere. If a sudden blindside on Shuichi took him out I would still be in the F4, probably the F3. That was the nature of my play, I could adjust to be compatable with everyone's plans and everyone was telling me enough to idol if somehow the vote did turn my way. Shuichi would have died at multiple points without immunity or if specific votes hadn't happened. I don't think he had options and if he had managed to get me voted out at F6 without an idol he'd probably straight up lose the game. I was the one with the ability to protect both of us if immunity failed. |
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Nagito Komaeda
Ultimate Lucky Student
Let's commit the perfect crime together so despair can become the foundation of hope!
Posts: 667
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Post by Nagito Komaeda on Oct 10, 2018 9:04:25 GMT
Also not an answer to your question but you were pretty awesome before you took Celes's advice about sending angry PMs.
I tried to give Celes a chance to win and I wouldn't even be bitter if she had.
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Post by Shuichi Saihara on Oct 10, 2018 13:54:08 GMT
Ok, I have time for at least one before work. Hiyoko. Yes, I totally did treat you wrong. As of right now, if I could change one thing in my game, it would be the way I treated you. What I can do is give the full context of my mistake, and I don't think it will make it better, but I still need to give it. After you endeared yourself to the entire silver trio group I noticed all my attempts to get them to vote you out as an easy vote were met with a lot of resistance. So at that point, I basically thought, "do I push my influence and try to force you out, or accept you're here for the long haul and try to work closer with you. If you can't beat em, join em" When you reached out to me with basically the same gameplan I had I was like, "Yeah okay. This can work" I didn't see you going up on the block. After Kyoko won we talked quite a bit who she would put up, and you were 4th priority in her list. So I thought it would be safe to make that deal with you and make you feel safe as a basis for future rounds. Then Sayaka participated in the veto and she actually won. Then you actually did get put up. I wasn't able to vote out Yasuhiro there. I overextended myself that round and I was certain to make someone upset. It was foolish for me to commit to you before I was certain you wouldn't be in the hot seat. If Sayaka didn't win the veto, and ended up on the bloc instead, I think my messaging to you could have paved the way for us working quite closely together in the endgame. I came up with a weak excuse to vote you after I admit. The next vote, the main reason I didn't try to repair it, was because I know why you were angry, and I couldn't think of anything that would make it better. Like, I told you "yeah, lets go deep" and then that very round I'm like "jk" so at the very best, you thought I was a slimy lying backstabber. I could have asked for forgiveness, but that wouldn't be much better, especially since at that point, I knew I had to vote you again soon because there's no reason you'd trust me again. Plus, my attempts to jury manage would probably come off as insincere if that was my only motive to talk to you after. I basically thought it best to just give you some space. I'm still going to fight for you jury vote. I'm not going to get it from you based on jury management skills and I'll have to get it a different way. If you told me it was more likely you'd quantum entangle with a star before getting your jury vote, I'll still fight for it. Also, that's not fair comparing us to Celestia as hype winners. Celestia would make anyone uninspiring compared to us.  Even after she was eliminated I was still hearing funny stories about her smart and manipulative plays. Like how she told everyone she'd vote for them in the end if she was on the jury xD. She knew how to get people to like her. |
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Post by Shuichi Saihara on Oct 10, 2018 14:13:53 GMT
Mikan also told me I'm a cocky fuck who doesn't deserve to win and she's looking forward to rubbing salt in my face. As painful as it was to have that conversation I think it did me good to hear some humbling backtalk. This isn't really your question but. The only person I discussed my relationship with Shuichi with was Mikan. Calling him my lackey is her words. I said she saw him as the one controlling my every move when from my perspective he'd done everything I'd told him to, including lying on my behalf multiple times. I noticed he left any evidence we'd ever plotted together before an F3 pact out of his opening speech which should be evidence enough he doesn't want to talk about it. What separates us positively? He was never my entire plan and I didn't rely on him to get anywhere. If a sudden blindside on Shuichi took him out I would still be in the F4, probably the F3. That was the nature of my play, I could adjust to be compatable with everyone's plans and everyone was telling me enough to idol if somehow the vote did turn my way. Shuichi would have died at multiple points without immunity or if specific votes hadn't happened. I don't think he had options and if he had managed to get me voted out at F6 without an idol he'd probably straight up lose the game. I was the one with the ability to protect both of us if immunity failed.  Before our final 3 pact, we were in a grant total of 2 class trials. The first one was Teruteru where neither of us had much sway. I went along with it because I had no relationship with him so w/e. Apparently he was your ally. The second one was the Ibuki vote which you went along with when me and a bunch of other people wanted it. I'm not sure which plotting we did that you think would be relevant to include in my opening speech. But you did think I was your lackey. A big part of it was because some of the things I told you. When you told me to vote out Sonia and I did, I was like, "You're right! You're so smart... You're going to be my survivor psychologist / mentor.... I'm using you and my clique as my guru to help me get through this game... etc. What's more accurate though? Sonia and Mikan were pitching me to vote out Kirumi. They had good and valid points. Sayaka and Kirumi were pitching me to vote out Sonia. They also had good an valid points. I mention it in my clique for a fresh perspective and Nagito thinks Sonia should go too. And yes, of course Nagito has valid points too. I hear people out. I took all 5 arguments, and my own thoughts and chose to vote out Sonia. If any one person can claim to be the biggest influence on my vote that round it would be Sayaka. But I have no problem being convinced by arguments to do something. Nagito was often giving me giving me advice when I talked about my game, so I rolled with it and let him think I really needed it. But I was in a better position than him most of the game. In the Hope tribe, I remember mentioning to him that Sayaka seemed to be on the bottom, and he responded "As long as you're doing a good enough job talking to everyone, yeah Sayaka is at the bottom". And it was hard not to say "Dude, I'm probably higher on the power ranking scale then you right now You're in more danger than me" I actually did a similar thing with Gundham where I made him think I'm a lot less connected then I was. The clearest example of that was during the final 11 vote I was very busy talking to people. I was talking to Akane/Mikan/Sayaka discussing the fallout with Hiyoko and how we can regroup stronger without her. I was talking to Celest/Kyoko about this conspiracy and how to stay ahead of it. etc. Between all this, I get a message from Gundham where he says he's paranoid because no one is talking to him. I respond by going "Yeah man. No one's talking to me either. I hope we're not both on the outs" And we bonded over the fact no one was talking to us and how paranoid it made us. It wasn't true on my part, but that helped give me the perception I wanted Gundham to have on me while strengthening our alliance. Now I just hope the jury didn't view me that way . |
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Post by Gundham Tanaka on Oct 10, 2018 20:10:08 GMT
Gundham: To be frank I think your opening speech is terrible. You've arbitrarily come up with seven random words and said like "oh yeah I was nice so I'm RESPECTABLE (tm)". Although you're right in your speech that you were closer with Celestia than Kyoko was, I think you were the socially weakest of that three. You hitched your vote to the wrong wagons early in the merge (voting with me twice) and got associated with that trio. You correctly flipped from that trio, but you did it in a way that pissed both of them off, and you flipped to another pair who, from my perspective, played both sides stronger than you did. In one sentence, without any word-salad, explain why I'm wrong. (on the speech) Eh, I wanted to try something different for an FTC speech, but oh well, guess it didn't work for you. (on the actual important part) By the time I was "voting wrong" Ibuki and Hiro were already out, and I had enough people going to bat for me that it didn't matter whether I voted correctly or not, someone who wasn't part of my core group of friends was going, and I definitely wasn't. |
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Hiyoko Saionji
Blackened
The color of the Communist Manifesto
Posts: 627
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Post by Hiyoko Saionji on Oct 10, 2018 22:25:46 GMT
Shuichi you said in your opening speech you had evidence you would have survived each round when you won a challenge, while others have said you would have been voted out. Given that's a major point of contention at this FTC, could you go into detail with your challenge wins?
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Hiyoko Saionji
Blackened
The color of the Communist Manifesto
Posts: 627
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Post by Hiyoko Saionji on Oct 11, 2018 0:18:21 GMT
to be honest I think Gundham's done a terrible job at FTC and nagito has as well, and he lost a lot of respect later in the game. So I'll say the same as what people were saying in the jury forum, I think Shuichi's probably winning in a lopsided margin. And at this moment that's where my vote is going as well (but Shuichi hasn't turned up much to fail his FTC yet rip)
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Post by Shuichi Saihara on Oct 11, 2018 1:11:25 GMT
The evidence is that I had Nagito and Gundham on my side. Final round, I wasn't immune and they prioritized going to the end with me over Mikan. In hindsight, I think it was a pretty big blessing I lost that challenge so I could prove my efforts with those two since way back in early merge paid off.
At final 5, if I wasn't immune, us 3 would have voted against Celestia or Mikan. I probably would have died due to Mikan's idol since she said she wanted to idol me out that round, but it still would have taken an idol to take me out.
Final 6, again, my alliance made up the half of the game, and our side had idols. There's a good chance the influence of us 3 could have got Celestia to vote against Akane, although I'm not 100% sure. To claim I easily would have died that round is false unless Nagito or Gundham want to say they'd vote for me that round.
Final 7, I wasn't immune and survived.
Final 8, I don't see any evidence I was going home that round. Everyone was pretty against Sayaka. If I'm wrong I guess now's the time for people to say so?
Merge boot was the last time before that I was immune, and again there's no evidence I'm aware of that I was in danger that round.
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Hiyoko Saionji
Blackened
The color of the Communist Manifesto
Posts: 627
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Post by Hiyoko Saionji on Oct 11, 2018 2:27:50 GMT
I think what really separates you from the others for me is that when I was inventing (and then being left out of and flipping on) the Celestia plan, people were like no we can't tell nagito, are you on crack? Nagito would leak for sure. And nobody was telling that plan to Gundham. But people did tell Shuichi, and people on both sides were quite comfortable with Shuichi then and afterwards. Frankly I think this is a mediocre f3. I will remember everyone else in the merge, possibly excepting like Chihiro, before I remember you guys as characters. Your social games are all barely adequate but nothing special. But I think Shuichi played the middle better (even if Akane voted the middle, nobody trusted her) and with his four challenge wins that's enough for me to be confident advocating for him to win the game. No further questions.
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Hiyoko Saionji
Blackened
The color of the Communist Manifesto
Posts: 627
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Post by Hiyoko Saionji on Oct 11, 2018 2:33:12 GMT
you all still suck at jury management though seriously, i know it's me saying this but be nicer to people. or not that because you were all nice, but more respectful of people. take lessons from celestia or some shit idk
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Post by Shuichi Saihara on Oct 11, 2018 2:51:30 GMT
Thank you! You were not one I was thinking I'd get and even though I know you're still unimpressed with me, it's still one that means a lot to me I do want to respond to one more thing from that (counts as 3rd question?) in case Akane is reading your thread. Out of everyone in the merge, the two I know the least about by quite a margin are you and Akane. This is because we never met before the merge, and after the merge hit there really wasn't too much time to actually get to know each other. Especially considering you broke your phone (and ironically I broke my phone not long after too lmao) and it became much harder to communicate on top of merge craziness. So it makes sense I wasn't that unique to you, and why Akane is pretty unimpressed with me too. |
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Nagito Komaeda
Ultimate Lucky Student
Let's commit the perfect crime together so despair can become the foundation of hope!
Posts: 667
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Post by Nagito Komaeda on Oct 11, 2018 7:14:33 GMT
I think what really separates you from the others for me is that when I was inventing (and then being left out of and flipping on) the Celestia plan, people were like no we can't tell nagito, are you on crack? Nagito would leak for sure. And nobody was telling that plan to Gundham. But people did tell Shuichi, and people on both sides were quite comfortable with Shuichi then and afterwards. Frankly I think this is a mediocre f3. I will remember everyone else in the merge, possibly excepting like Chihiro, before I remember you guys as characters. Your social games are all barely adequate but nothing special. But I think Shuichi played the middle better (even if Akane voted the middle, nobody trusted her) and with his four challenge wins that's enough for me to be confident advocating for him to win the game. No further questions. The people you were conspiring to vote Celes with were the same people dropping brick-hints about the Celes plan they didn't want you to tell me about. Without being trusted I still knew enough that when you asked I told you there was a plan against the Losers no one wanted me to know the details of and I was concerned. Considering what I've said about Celes being important to me, isn't it more they knew I wasn't crazy enough to help kill Celes for the same people that wanted me dead on Future Foundation? I simply didn't know Mikan and Sayaka before that like Shuichi did. It's why I was on board for Sayaka before Chihiro medevacced and things got awkward. I knew this wouldn't be an FTC people got excited over. The most interesting people were too caught up with each other and we're left instead. I expected you not to respect me for burning you, though I didn't expect you to respect Shuichi more. I'm still going to argue I at least had a reason for treating you like a dangerous opponent that could burn my house down while he was just careless with how he treated people going out. |
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Hiyoko Saionji
Blackened
The color of the Communist Manifesto
Posts: 627
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Post by Hiyoko Saionji on Oct 11, 2018 11:47:22 GMT
oh shit i forgot i wasn't going to reveal my vote until i asked this non-serious question that i wanted you to think was important
uh roast me and the other finalists in a way that actually makes me laugh. this will definitely have an effect in any way ty ty
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Post by Shuichi Saihara on Oct 12, 2018 0:24:48 GMT
lol, I might save that for my closing speech.
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Hiyoko Saionji
Blackened
The color of the Communist Manifesto
Posts: 627
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Post by Hiyoko Saionji on Oct 12, 2018 4:50:38 GMT
hey i just want to let you all one final time that you're all terrible *tears up* i'll miss this
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Post by Gundham Tanaka on Oct 12, 2018 4:54:05 GMT
Thanks for the words of encouragement, babe.
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Nagito Komaeda
Ultimate Lucky Student
Let's commit the perfect crime together so despair can become the foundation of hope!
Posts: 667
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Post by Nagito Komaeda on Oct 12, 2018 4:54:11 GMT
There's still time for you to post your burn list..
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Hiyoko Saionji
Blackened
The color of the Communist Manifesto
Posts: 627
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Post by Hiyoko Saionji on Oct 12, 2018 4:56:05 GMT
let's all not become friends after the game <3 <3 <3
seriously though you should all genuinely proud of the games you played, even if you only made an f3 bc i called you out as the best players. i don't think this was a great or interesting game overall but f3 is a good achievement.
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Hiyoko Saionji
Blackened
The color of the Communist Manifesto
Posts: 627
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Post by Hiyoko Saionji on Oct 12, 2018 4:56:52 GMT
i love that people have got around the three questions rule by just throwing statements around and then being like oh you responded this wasn't a question i see you celestia.
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Post by Gundham Tanaka on Oct 12, 2018 5:02:38 GMT
Also everytime you post about us sucking (no matter how much you believe it) I want to just post this quote:
"A Man is very apt to complain of the ingratitude of those who have risen far above him" not completely relevant, but still fun.
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Post by Shuichi Saihara on Oct 12, 2018 5:04:01 GMT
It might not go down as one of the most interesting games, but I think it's safe to say it had one of the most iconic moments.  I'm not even going to roast you in my final post because nothing I say can compare to what you did to yourself that round. I hope you realize I showed it to some friends in the real world who don't give a shit about survivor and still found it hilarious. |
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Hiyoko Saionji
Blackened
The color of the Communist Manifesto
Posts: 627
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Post by Hiyoko Saionji on Oct 12, 2018 5:06:19 GMT
also i wanted to finally conclude (past the deadline i know, rabble) that nagito's several efforts to pander to me by pretending his biggest regret was not taking me to the end do not work.
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Nagito Komaeda
Ultimate Lucky Student
Let's commit the perfect crime together so despair can become the foundation of hope!
Posts: 667
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Post by Nagito Komaeda on Oct 12, 2018 5:09:36 GMT
Yes, pretending. No, I really think it was stupid of me to do that to you. The fact that I could not get you to trust me despite how often I tried is my biggest regret. |
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Even after she was eliminated I was still hearing funny stories about her smart and manipulative plays. Like how she told everyone she'd vote for them in the end if she was on the jury xD. She knew how to get people to like her.
